[BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

John Paton John.Paton at rnib.org.uk
Mon Jul 24 11:11:58 BST 2017


Hi Jackie,

RNIB in your pocket was designed to work over the network connection. That's why it isn't even sold as a standalone device without a contract because if it relied on WiFi then an inaccessible WiFi connection process would be a dealbreaker. 

The target demographic for RNIB in your pocket is far less likely to have broadband and WiFi because if they did then there are other routes to accessing talking books and newspapers which may be more appropriate. Since WiFi could add value it was still enabled despite not yet being accessible. It was not intended to be the way people accessed their books unless the network connection or the (fairly large) data allowance was insufficient. It is a feature that I understand RealThing are keen to build in but since the device is targeted at less technical users who are unlikely to have WiFi to connect to it is a lower priority than other features.

I hope that makes sense,

John

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: 24 July 2017 10:08
To: 'BCAB Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Steve

I do get it that lots of older people with failing sight and additional
physical problems might find the likes of Synapptic, Bumblebee or In Your
Pocket the answer to some of their frustrations.  After all, not all blind
and partially sighted people are tech savvy.  But I don't like the way these
products are marketed: just press one button here, or tap that icon there,
and the world is your oyster! In Your Pocket requires sighted assistance to
input a WiFi key, and perhaps Synapptic and Bumblebee are the same.  This
notion that there is a sighted person on hand to do this kind of thing on
your behalf is just so misguided.

But heck, what do we know?

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info
Follow me on Twitter: @thebrownsplace
Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: 24 July 2017 08:51
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Jackie,

I guessed as much.  You would have to come out of its interface, turn on
Talkback or Voice Assistant then do it, if Talkback is even installed to
that device.

What is really galling is that both RNIB In Your Pocket and Bumble Bee are
based on Samsung devices, and one thing that Samsung has that other Android
devices don't have is triple click to activate Talkback.  But it is turned
off by default.  So British Wireless or RNIB could have arranged for this to
be turned on by default in both products.

Maybe these organisations think that all blind people have "carers"?

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: 23 July 2017 17:05
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Graham

You mean Bumblebee can't be connected to WiFi out of the box without sighted
assistance?  It gets worse!

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Graham Page
Sent: 23 July 2017 16:26
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

On the version I tried it wasn't and indeed you had to enter the SSID
yourself unless you enabled talkback and then went to phone settings.

On RNIB in your pocket it seems they didn't see fit to make connecting to
WiFi accessible either which is one of the reasons I didn't go for it.

Regards

Graham

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: 21 July 2017 10:13
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Steve

I don't know.  The first Sonata wasn't accessible to add a WiFi key, but the
Plus model was.  I would hope speech guidance for those who need it would be
there throughout the setting up process.

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: 21 July 2017 10:00
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Jackie,

And do you think the entering of the wi-fi key is accessible?  I bet it
isn't.  Bit like RNIB In Your Pocket.

Kind of defeats the object of a special accessible device really.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: 21 July 2017 09:47
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Correct Steve.  VoiceOver or TalkBack isn't on by default Clive but you have
the option.

But getting back to the thread itself of Bumblebee, I understand it is all
configured and ready to turn on when it arrives from BWBF.  You still have
to put your WiFi key in though and probably your account details, so while
they try to make it easy for you, there are still some things you have to do
yourself no matter what.

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Steve Nutt
Sent: 21 July 2017 09:09
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Clive,

It simply means that the speech is there as an "option", but not as default.
Sighted people wouldn't want VoiceOver on by default, but it is there as an
option.  Nothing more complicated than that.

All the best

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Clive Lever
Sent: 20 July 2017 22:28
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Jackie,

I see, you mean the option of turning, say, voiceover on and off on your
mobile? I can see the practical advantage of being able to turn it on or
silence it. When you're in a meeting, you might want your phone on silent
vibrate, so that the ring tone doesn't disturb other attendees, and to turn
voice-over off sothat it doesn't chatter in your pocket during proceedings.
Or, do you mean that when you take it out of the box, speech is off and you
have to activate it.

The problem I've noticed is that not enough staff selling and demonstrating
IPhones and other devices know how to turn the screenreader on, let alone
how to use the device when the software is active. If they haven't learned,
how can they understand or teach?

Best,
Clive



-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 6:24 PM
To: 'BCAB Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Clive

As far as I know, they are offering accessibility by default, I meant as an
option for those who want to use it.

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Clive Lever
Sent: 20 July 2017 18:01
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Jackie,

I didn't realise that Apple were now only offering the accessibility
functions as an option and not by default. That seems like a retrograde step
in my view.


Best,
Clive

-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2017 9:20 AM
To: 'BCAB Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Clive

No, we want a standard item with accessibility functions built into it to
include everyone.  Apple, Google and latterly to some extent, Amazon, are
offering standard products with TTS built in as an option.

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate


-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Clive Lever
Sent: 19 July 2017 23:02
To: 'BCAB Discussion List' <bcab at lists.bcab.org.uk>
Subject: Re: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

Hi Jackie,

I don't like the idea of having radios which do a specific job, specially
designed for the blind, on loan to a limited group of blind people but not
available to buy. Did I read later in the thread that they are considering
making this available for a subscription, so you would always be in the
pocket of BWBF? If that's correct, I'm ill-at-ease with that idea too.

Best,
Clive



-----Original Message-----
From: Bcab [mailto:bcab-bounces at lists.bcab.org.uk] On Behalf Of Jackie Brown
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2017 9:40 AM
To: 'BCAB Discussion List'
Subject: [BCAB] BWBF launches Bumblebee

I don't want to start bashing this as I haven't seen it.  But BWBF (British
Wireless for the Blind Fund) has launched a Samsung tablet with locked
proprietary software on it called Bumblebee.  Its yellow and black contrast
with speech feedback allows you to enter a number of applications to listen
to radio stations, podcasts, books, newspapers and other information.  It is
only available on loan to those who "meet the criteria."

This to me sounds like another Synaptic product with layered software over a
Samsung tablet which cannot be unlocked.  I would just ask these questions:
who comes up with the research stats for these kind of products?  Are these
kind of devices as popular as our organisations seem to think?  Am I being
too cynical?

Kind regards,

Jackie Brown
Email: Jackieannbrown62 at gmail.com
Check out my website: www.thebrownsplace.info Follow me on Twitter:
@thebrownsplace Skype name: thejackmate




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